certainly not silver(?)

[Nazarach]

Little Quiet comes from a line of really dillution heavy horses (on the dams side), my problem is, he seems to have a white/silver mane when there is not really anything in his line that should have silver... is it because he is still young and the mane will darken with age or does the seemingly white come from genes like an additional Cr or something? Or is he less 'white' than his mother because he is not black but bay? (I couldn't find a horse for reference so I don't know)

Quiet Godling

So far I'd guess his coding something along the lines of E_ A/a Ch/n n/prl (the pale freckles for Ch/n; one A from his sire)
Ra
;

definitly a and n/prl from his dam
Shizuka


as for the rest I'm not too sure...

[Silverine]

So far I'd guess his coding something along the lines of E_ A/a Ch/n n/prl (the pale freckles for Ch/n; one A from his sire)

definitly a and n/prl from his dam

So I wouldn't automatically jump to E/_ on this boy. There are actually a couple things going on that could be explained by a red base. But I'll get into that later.

First things first, looking at his pedigree you're correct in saying that he has a prl from his dam and Ch from his sire. So we know that those have to be in play. However, we do not know yet if he is n/prl or if he is Cr/prl - cream and pearl are on the same locus, so they can't be separated. Looking at his sire, we know for certain that your boy has at least one copy of tiger eye. His eyes aren't 'vibrant' enough for two copies, but the one copy is still showing through because of his champagne.

Next, this boy's foal picture is definitely showing dilution. He would be much more gold in color if he was plain amber, sable, or gold champagne. Pearl by itself won't show as a dilution, so there has to be something more going on. Looking at his pedigree the only other thing that could possibly be working on his coat is cream. That makes him Cr/prl. (This also makes sense with his eyes, which would be slightly darker at his current age even with tiger eye.)

So then what's his base coat? He's got an 'a' from his dam, but he's not black - he has too much yellow/brown color for that. So we have to look at his dad. As his dad is bay-based we know he has an A, but both of the sire's parents are A/a (both bay-based from one bay and one black parent), so the only other gene his sire could carry is an 'a' and we know this boy isn't black-based. However, that still leaves us with two options - bay base, or black hidden by a red base.

Now we have to do a bit of digging to try and figure out what is going on. Is it possible this boy is ee? His closest red-based ancestors are his great-grandparents on his dam's side, and both of his grandparents on that side had one red-based ancestor, so they're both Ee, leaving a 66% that his dam is Ee since we know she isn't ee; that means there's a 33% chance he inherited an e from his mother. I looked at his sire's other progeny and found that he has thrown a palomino foal, so the sire is Ee, leaving a 50% chance that this boy inherited his 'e'. Those together give a 16.67% chance of an ee foal, which is about 1 in 6 and is actually pretty decent odds.

So where does that leave us? There are two likely possibilites:
1. Gold Cream Pearl ([A,a]/a e/e Cr/prl Ch/ch+ z+/z+ d+/d+ t/t lp+/lp+)
2. Amber Cream Pearl (A/a E+/e Cr/prl Ch/ch+ z+/z+ d+/d+ t/t lp+/lp+)

Personally I think Gold Cream Pearl is more likely, particularly because of the lightened, flaxen-ish mane and tail and the uniformity of his coat color. Even at one year his legs were not noticeably different from his body. However, I could be wrong. The best way to test it would be to breed him with a few chestnut mares and see what pops out. If they're all red-based, chances are your boy is red-based too.

[Nazarach]

So far I'd guess his coding something along the lines of E_ A/a Ch/n n/prl (the pale freckles for Ch/n; one A from his sire)

definitly a and n/prl from his dam

So I wouldn't automatically jump to E/_ on this boy. There are actually a couple things going on that could be explained by a red base. But I'll get into that later.

First things first, looking at his pedigree you're correct in saying that he has a prl from his dam and Ch from his sire. So we know that those have to be in play. However, we do not know yet if he is n/prl or if he is Cr/prl - cream and pearl are on the same locus, so they can't be separated. Looking at his sire, we know for certain that your boy has at least one copy of tiger eye. His eyes aren't 'vibrant' enough for two copies, but the one copy is still showing through because of his champagne.

Next, this boy's foal picture is definitely showing dilution. He would be much more gold in color if he was plain amber, sable, or gold champagne. Pearl by itself won't show as a dilution, so there has to be something more going on. Looking at his pedigree the only other thing that could possibly be working on his coat is cream. That makes him Cr/prl. (This also makes sense with his eyes, which would be slightly darker at his current age even with tiger eye.)

So then what's his base coat? He's got an 'a' from his dam, but he's not black - he has too much yellow/brown color for that. So we have to look at his dad. As his dad is bay-based we know he has an A, but both of the sire's parents are A/a (both bay-based from one bay and one black parent), so the only other gene his sire could carry is an 'a' and we know this boy isn't black-based. However, that still leaves us with two options - bay base, or black hidden by a red base.

Now we have to do a bit of digging to try and figure out what is going on. Is it possible this boy is ee? His closest red-based ancestors are his great-grandparents on his dam's side, and both of his grandparents on that side had one red-based ancestor, so they're both Ee, leaving a 66% that his dam is Ee since we know she isn't ee; that means there's a 33% chance he inherited an e from his mother. I looked at his sire's other progeny and found that he has thrown a palomino foal, so the sire is Ee, leaving a 50% chance that this boy inherited his 'e'. Those together give a 16.67% chance of an ee foal, which is about 1 in 6 and is actually pretty decent odds.

So where does that leave us? There are two likely possibilites:
1. Gold Cream Pearl ([A,a]/a e/e Cr/prl Ch/ch+ z+/z+ d+/d+ t/t lp+/lp+)
2. Amber Cream Pearl (A/a E+/e Cr/prl Ch/ch+ z+/z+ d+/d+ t/t lp+/lp+)

Personally I think Gold Cream Pearl is more likely, particularly because of the lightened, flaxen-ish mane and tail and the uniformity of his coat color. Even at one year his legs were not noticeably different from his body. However, I could be wrong. The best way to test it would be to breed him with a few chestnut mares and see what pops out. If they're all red-based, chances are your boy is red-based too.

Finally an answer; so many thanks for taking the time
Makes sense, his sire threw the palomino much later than I posted the question, so I wasn't aware of a rather high chance his foal being ee ^^' but that would be quite possible as he indeed has no visible 'discoloured' legs...
Many thanks again for pointing this out and helping with the rest of his coding

[Silverine]

Finally an answer; so many thanks for taking the time
Makes sense, his sire threw the palomino much later than I posted the question, so I wasn't aware of a rather high chance his foal being ee ^^' but that would be quite possible as he indeed has no visible 'discoloured' legs...
Many thanks again for pointing this out and helping with the rest of his coding

No problem! I quite enjoy puzzles, and he certainly was/is one. Let me know if you get any babies from him - I'd like to see what he throws.

[Nazarach]

No problem! I quite enjoy puzzles, and he certainly was/is one. Let me know if you get any babies from him - I'd like to see what he throws.

Hi there, so here is his first daughter - and she certainly is a confirmation for the chestnut (and the champagne - but that was obvious) at least:

Golden Champagne (e/e A? Ch/n n/prl t/N) - at least I'm pretty sure...

unknown

[Silverine]

Hi there, so here is his first daughter - and she certainly is a confirmation for the chestnut (and the champagne - but that was obvious) at least:

Golden Champagne (e/e A? Ch/n n/prl t/N) - at least I'm pretty sure...

unknown

She certainly looks gold champagne from where I'm sitting.